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Climate Fun
Topic Started: Dec 28 2010, 12:23 AM (4,989 Views)
Setenza Dec 28 2010, 12:23 AM Post #1
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Knitting with only one needle
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 Seems like as bad a time as ever to look at global warming / climate change .

We had the completely ignored Cancun climte deal, which seems to do the same as previous deals - which seems like as little as possible.

I've ignored the issue for a while now since it seems to be more of a politcal issue than anything else. Are we still doomed?

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findus Dec 28 2010, 01:08 AM Post #2
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Jerry Kerr
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 "I wish they'd gie some o yon 'global warming' tae Tannadice, likes!"

There, I said it.

It's a scam, is and always has been. Whether we're the culprits or not, shiit happens, climate changes, get the hell on with it. We've got far bigger problems to face as a species, such as sanitation, water shortages, soil pollution and such.
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The Eggman Dec 29 2010, 08:45 AM Post #3
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Tommy McLean
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findus
Dec 28 2010, 01:08 AM
It's a scam, is and always has been. Whether we're the culprits or not, shiit happens, climate changes, get the hell on with it. We've got far bigger problems to face as a species, such as sanitation, water shortages, soil pollution and such.

Some of those problems are a result of man-made climate change. And those problems will continue to worsen as the impact of man-made changes increase. Slow down the rate of climate change, and the problems will be less.

Abrogation of self-responsibility won't do, Findus. Bury your head in the sand all you like, but you are responsible. We're all responsible.
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Setenza Dec 29 2010, 11:01 AM Post #4
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The Eggman
Dec 29 2010, 08:45 AM
We're all responsible.

Even those with no carbon foot print and who are super eco?


There's 2 things that's never felt right with me. First, that we need to prepare to deal with climate changes whether we are responsible or not, as it might happen anyway. Second, how do you do that without turning into a mad dictator police state that would be a whole lot worse than anything climate change could do.


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The Eggman Dec 29 2010, 11:56 AM Post #5
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Tommy McLean
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Setenza
Dec 29 2010, 11:01 AM
The Eggman
Dec 29 2010, 08:45 AM
We're all responsible.

Even those with no carbon foot print and who are super eco?

I was referring to us, really (first world people who use tvs etc).
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The Eggman Dec 29 2010, 11:58 AM Post #6
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Tommy McLean
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Setenza
Dec 29 2010, 11:01 AM
The Eggman
Dec 29 2010, 08:45 AM
We're all responsible.

Second, how do you do that without turning into a mad dictator police state that would be a whole lot worse than anything climate change could do.

I don't agree that a mad police dictator state would be worse than anything climate change can do.
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Setenza Dec 29 2010, 12:33 PM Post #7
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The Eggman
Dec 29 2010, 11:58 AM

I don't agree that a mad police dictator state would be worse than anything climate change can do.

The latest UN climate change report thing said that sea levels will probably rise by 18 to 59 centimetres by the end of the century. Which would undoubtly cause some issues for a few regions around the world.

I've never seen any plan for how the required changes are going to happen without some kind of force since it's plain that not enough people actually care enough. As well as lots of bans (naughty patio heaters), some people talk of rationing, flight restrictions, number of children restictions etc etc. I'd rather have a world with 33cm sea level rises and a few more severe weather systems than that. Ok, that's not to say that any of these things might happen, but how else are the required changes going to happen?
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Setenza Dec 29 2010, 12:35 PM Post #8
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The Eggman
Dec 29 2010, 11:56 AM
Setenza
Dec 29 2010, 11:01 AM
The Eggman
Dec 29 2010, 08:45 AM
We're all responsible.

Even those with no carbon foot print and who are super eco?

I was referring to us, really (first world people who use tvs etc).

As well as the chinese no doubt.



I've just booked a long haul flight, and I can pay £25 or something to carbon offset it. I didn't bother.... It's not that I don't care, it's just that it'd aimless and pointless.
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The Eggman Dec 29 2010, 01:09 PM Post #9
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Tommy McLean
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Setenza
Dec 29 2010, 12:35 PM
I've just booked a long haul flight, and I can pay £25 or something to carbon offset it. I didn't bother.... It's not that I don't care, it's just that it'd aimless and pointless.

Is there an aim of the £25 carbon offset - it must have that figure for a reason.

Just as with every little use of fossil fuel energy (like a trip to the shops in a petrol car) accummulating negatively, then every little offset (whatever it is) would help balance that, or at least go some way towards it.
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The Eggman Dec 29 2010, 01:13 PM Post #10
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Tommy McLean
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Setenza
Dec 29 2010, 12:33 PM
I've never seen any plan for how the required changes are going to happen without some kind of force since it's plain that not enough people actually care enough.

I agree. A lot of people care (which helps than no people caring, of course), but loads don't. Without anyone caring, the rate of climate change would (arguably) be even higher.

I'd be happy with people being compelled to be greener. But it does come at a cost (liberty, economics etc), so it's painful.
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Setenza Dec 29 2010, 01:53 PM Post #11
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The Eggman
Dec 29 2010, 01:09 PM
Setenza
Dec 29 2010, 12:35 PM
I've just booked a long haul flight, and I can pay £25 or something to carbon offset it. I didn't bother.... It's not that I don't care, it's just that it'd aimless and pointless.

Is there an aim of the £25 carbon offset - it must have that figure for a reason.

Just as with every little use of fossil fuel energy (like a trip to the shops in a petrol car) accummulating negatively, then every little offset (whatever it is) would help balance that, or at least go some way towards it.

I'm sure there's a cost per carbon price worked out.

Quote:
 

Where does your money go?
Your money goes towards supporting projects in developing countries and typically focuses on providing new sources of renewable energy and in promoting energy-efficiency schemes. In addition to balancing your CO2, the projects we have chosen must also bring social and economic benefits to the communities in which they are based and often bring added health benefits too through improvements in local air quality.

What are the projects?
Morgan Stanley fund emission reduction projects in developing countries around the world and maintains a portfolio of carbon credits on behalf of British Airways customers. The location of the projects selected reflects the global nature of our business.

We select credits from a number of renewable energy schemes including a hydroelectric scheme in Brazil and a hydroelectric scheme and wind farm in China.


So I'd be paying for a chinese wind farm? I think I preferred the plant a tree schemes to be honest.

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Setenza Dec 29 2010, 01:54 PM Post #12
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The Eggman
Dec 29 2010, 01:13 PM
I agree. A lot of people care (which helps than no people caring, of course), but loads don't. Without anyone caring, the rate of climate change would (arguably) be even higher.

I'd be happy with people being compelled to be greener. But it does come at a cost (liberty, economics etc), so it's painful.

What kind of things would you like to see compelled?
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The Eggman Dec 29 2010, 03:37 PM Post #13
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Tommy McLean
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Setenza
Dec 29 2010, 01:54 PM
What kind of things would you like to see compelled?

Higher fares for flights and fossil fuels, and lower - much lower - prices for more efficient energy like lpg. Bigger petrol guzzling cars should be hammered.
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The Eggman Dec 29 2010, 03:38 PM Post #14
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Tommy McLean
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Setenza
Dec 29 2010, 01:53 PM
So I'd be paying for a chinese wind farm? I think I preferred the plant a tree schemes to be honest.

Or a hydro-electric dam in Brazil.

Every little bit helps, etc.
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YazooArab Dec 29 2010, 06:23 PM Post #15
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Paul Sturrock
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 I had my kilt on for Christmas dinner and my globes were well warmed.
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