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| Relegation | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jan 3 2016, 12:28 AM (7,002 Views) | |
| Setenza | Jan 3 2016, 12:28 AM Post #1 |
Knitting with only one needle
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After a long day - 2 Questions: Does anyone think we'll stay up? Does getting relegated affect the enjoyment of following united? Despite trying to be positive, I can't see us staying up. We've more problems that can be solved with just a few new players in January. I'm sure we'll improve, but it'll be too late and there's not a huge number of points left to play for. This season, and year, has been as miserable a season as I can remember for a long time. Aside from just the constant losing, there's been the boardroom point scoring, bickering fans and the managerial mess. That's all combined to mean it's a chore to turn up at games. But attending is a habit that probably won't end soon I'll still turn up even if we are relegated. Since the random things - the players coming through the system and doing well, has beens from around the world ending up in Dundee - give me more enjoyment than just winning from time to time, I doubt a season in the Championship will really be any less enjoyable than this, or another season fighting it. Of course, fighting for the title might be more fun, but I'm assuming that won't happen. |
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| Conan the Destroyer | Jan 3 2016, 12:47 AM Post #2 |
I prefer it when we're pish
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It's inevitable, but life goes on. The wife supports Dumbarton so that'll be fun. |
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| Tom_Boland | Jan 3 2016, 11:06 AM Post #3 |
Ivan Golac
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Doubt if we're gonna manage to stay up now.
No. We've been down before. (95-96) With regards to Dumbarton. They were a godsend. We beat them twice in the 2nd half of the 95-96 Season, think it was 6-1 and 8-0, helping us to have a big enough goal difference that got us 2nd place and into the play-offs, where we beat Thistle to get promoted. |
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| Naebody | Jan 3 2016, 11:45 AM Post #4 |
Twat
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It's weird to think that, over one single day in January, we went from the league's second-best team to the worst it's ever hosted. Fortunes change amazingly quickly in football, and for that reason I don't rule out the possibility of us going on a good run in the back half of the season. However, rescuing anything from the starting point we have is hugely unlikely. Part of me says, "we've suffered some shitty luck over the past year. If the cosmos counterbalances and we get some extraordinary good luck in 2016, we might just get out of this." That's the compulsive gambler part of my brain talking, though. The logical remainder says that, because a godless cosmos is ambivalent to our fortunes, we'll be relegated. We deserve to be. No team in SPL history has deserved relegation more. As to question two: I've said before that I quite enjoyed the season in division one. It involved new places to visit and starting most games as clear favourites, which was refreshing, and there was a general feeling around the club that the nadir had been passed. My main worry for next season is that the club's profile will be damaged, as all TV coverage of the division will disappear with The Rangers. (There's also the small issue of ex-pats like me not being able to see games.) But assuming Thompson does the right things -- ie, channel investment at the youth squad rather than sanction quick-fix signings, make sure cost cutting doesn't damage club infrastructure, and be ready to burn through around £1m -- it might be quite healthy to spend a year in the wilderness. |
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| Cobardon | Jan 3 2016, 12:12 PM Post #5 |
Uncle Smurf
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It does sound odd to say that luck has been a big part of it when we've made so many mistakes both on and off the field, but it really has. There's a reluctance among humans to accept the huge role fate has in life in general and therefore in sport. We like to think there's some form of justice and order in our world and that we aren't subject to whims of pure chance, but the truth is otherwise. We come up with meaningless statements like 'you make your own luck' and 'what's for you will no go by you' and so on. It's nonsense. Take the recent games Hamilton played in the city of Dundee. They were hapless in both games and gave chance after chance to the home team, while offering very little going forward. It wasn't their good play that the equally hapless Gunning decided to nod into his own net under no pressure and then the equally hapless Dillon shanked a clearance right to one of their players in front of an empty net. If Ziggy Gordon hadn't been standing exactly where he was he couldn't have first timed it back into the goal: it had to drop to his only good foot at the exact angle it did. He couldn't have stood at a better place and that was pure chance. At Dens, the one on ones that Kane Hemmings scored were both of the unmissable variety: in the first he was right through after a weak back header in a swirling wind and with the keeper already half way toward him and committed. An easy shimmy to the side and a roll into the empty net. The second was ever easier as the keeper and defender tackled each other leaving him an open goal. United missed a few one on ones in their game, but every time the keeper was able to block, which he had little or no chance to do against Dundee. The result was that Dundee - who did score one good goal - were three up in 20 minutes and after more terrible defending 4-0 in 25. Even United couldn't have lost from that position. Sure, Dundee took their chances better than United. Sure, Hamilton made even bigger blunders in that game. I'm not saying luck is the only factor in any game. But a 2 goal gifted cushion gives the confidence that any team needs to play a bit. And that's where the luck swung it. And, my main point, from Hamilton's point of view, is that they were tremendously lucky to win at Tannadice and tremendously unlucky to lose 4-0 at Dens. And are we relegated? Well, almost certainly. We do play all the bottom teams twice yet, but they only have to pick up points against each other to keep them above even a suddenly lucky United. |
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| Barca87 | Jan 3 2016, 01:05 PM Post #6 |
Gordon Chisholm
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The only thing that can save us is that one of the bottom of six go on some sort of calamitous run like we have been on. Out of everyone in the bottom six my money would be on Hamilton for one of those. It's unlikely to be calamitous enough, but it's possible, then the question would be could we string enough together to bring in either Kilmarnock of Motherwell. I'm not sure that, going on Cob's point, all of those stars will align. One could. but I doubt all of them. I do think if we went on some sort of run it would put the wind up of all three sides who will still, even today, think that we will come good and they don't want to be within reach if that happens. But was I say, I don't think everything will come together (not least us going on some sort of run). Presuming the Huns and Hibs go up, are we better than everyone else in the Championship, even allowing for departures? Probably, just. And perhaps once the trauma of the last 12 months has gotten out of the club, which relegation might actually help with, fresh start and all that, are we better than Motherwell or Kilmarnock or Hamilton? With a sensible January and summer in the transfer market, I would hope so. As for that season in the Championship, it was plenty exciting. Those games against Dunfermline (especially the one we lost at Tannadice which was effectively for the title in the run-in) and Morton, to say nothing of the Patrick play off games still stick in the memory. Funnily enough, as does Dumbarton, but not the shellackings we gave them, but when we played them at Boghead, and I remember going with my Dad and unusually my Mum came, and my Dad and I were busy saying we were going to score a hateful (I think we had signed Gary McSwegan that weekend) and Dumbarton won 1-0. More generally though, I'm not into this blaming Thompson for our predicament. Yes he has not helped, and selling the two etc, was a chronic lack of ambition, however, if he is to blame for anything, it was sticking with McNamara and backing him in the transfer market, when we could all see he had been rumbled and couldn't have changed his socks, let alone the direction the team was heading in. But to be honest, how many times do we as general football fans say, the Chairman needs to back his manager f he thinks he is the right guy. He clearly did think McNamara was the right guy, so he backed him... |
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| Naebody | Jan 3 2016, 01:16 PM Post #7 |
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Twat
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Incidentally, the section of Fever Pitch about Cambridge United getting relegated seems particularly apt right now. |
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| Setenza | Jan 3 2016, 03:10 PM Post #8 |
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Knitting with only one needle
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I think there's a decent chance Hibs will still be down next year. They're better than last year, and better than us, but still liable to fail when it counts. And when you look at St Mirren, it's not hard to see it being longer than just 1 season in the championship. Would that still be enjoyable? Probably. |
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| reekie | Jan 3 2016, 03:40 PM Post #9 |
lum raker
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Couldn't agree more with you, Cob. It's the fact that we've been playing half decently and creating that won't allow me to chuck the towel in quite yet. We don't look like a team ten points adrift (as in, we're not just lumping the ball forwards and clinging on in every game) and while we're far from 'too good to go down', I think we might still be 'not too bad to be certainties'. Quite yet... Edited by reekie, Jan 3 2016, 03:42 PM.
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| Naebody | Jan 3 2016, 05:23 PM Post #10 |
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Twat
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On the theme of luck, it's interesting that of our 15 league defeats, ten have been by a one-goal margin. Once draws are included, we've dropped 26 points due to a single goal (which is why we're 11 points below Kilmarnock having conceded the same number of goals). The team's failings are obvious and inarguable. But also, it's perverse not to admit that losing so regularly by narrow margins is quite unlucky. |
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| zico | Jan 3 2016, 05:47 PM Post #11 |
Ivan Golac
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Didnt we lose many games by just the odd goal in 1995? Watching United now the similarities are amazing. Ive given up all hope. Why hasnt the managerial bounce happened? Why is it we dont follow the accepted norms? Is Demel here for the.money? |
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| TheDean | Jan 3 2016, 07:41 PM Post #12 |
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ALLEGEDLY CALICO
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We've been down for weeks - the coup d' grace should mathematically be delivered by end February. Is there really any point following United in the Championship? The squad will still be poor, lack proper leadership on the park and continue to be riven by disputes in the boardroom- at least until our excellent Chairman finally gives up and hands over control to Justine. The only question remains whether the Diddleys will come down with us. I reckon there's every chance of that. |
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| Cobardon | Jan 3 2016, 07:47 PM Post #13 |
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Uncle Smurf
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To be fair, you've had us down since before a ball was kicked. You may well have been the wisest here in that respect. But it seems a bit pessimistic to assume we'll be every bit as bad a level down. We've little idea who will still be at the club a year from now - chair, players or manager - to start asserting such stuff. |
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| Naebody | Jan 3 2016, 08:59 PM Post #14 |
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Twat
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Have you ever had anything positive or optimistic to say about United, Calico? I scanned back to January 2014 but didn't find anything. Anyhoo ... United finishing 12th on Betfair is now 1.21 to buy, which implies an 83% likelihood. That looks about right. |
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| zico | Jan 3 2016, 09:40 PM Post #15 |
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Ivan Golac
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Naebody is there anything positive about our current situation. Never mind ST has cleared the debt almost just in time to.lead us back to where his dad came in. |
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