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Never given; Finally given
Topic Started: Mar 20 2011, 10:09 AM (1,369 Views)
findus
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Jerry Kerr
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Conan the Destroyer
Apr 6 2011, 09:36 AM
findus
Apr 6 2011, 09:25 AM
Conan the Destroyer
Apr 6 2011, 08:25 AM
My bugbear on penalties raised its head again at the weekend. Man Utd's penalty v West Ham, never ever in a million years deliberate handball.
The ref made some kind of arm-sweeping movement for that one as if he thought Upson (?) had swung his arm out to make contact. What the fcuk are they putting in referees' pre-match cuppa?

The best thing that could be done for the rule is to rename it as it is currently misleading leading to recurrent misuse. Change it to something like 'Deliberate arming'.
Given that the world at large seems incapable of establishing whether a handball is intentional (and I would venture that 90% of the time it isn't - who deliberately handles the ball in their own penalty area? You'd need to be mental) the rule should be amended to strict liability. If it hits your hand or arm it's a foul, mens rea or no.

Yes, it would be completely unfair, but at least it would be consistently unfair unlike the current situation which seems to just give an embattled referee an easy way of helping out Man Utd/Rangers/Spain when they're under the cosh. It would also spare my blood pressure when I have to listen to some semi-literate sexual inadequate craven toady of an ex-footballer opine about hands in an unnatural position.

Then a sound tactic would be to always aim to hit the ball off of any opponent's hand when in the penalty area. Not that hard given practice and an opponent(s) a few yards away, I'd imagine, especially if it follows a high ball into the box and an opposing player is on the deck, or even better trying to get up (arm rooted to the turf, easy target).

This would be very fair actually as both teams have the same disadvantage/advantage.

First and foremost, I'd like to see the 18 yard box changed to a semi-circle with an area of about 70% of the current box.
Edited by findus, Apr 6 2011, 09:59 AM.
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Conan the Destroyer
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I prefer it when we're pish
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findus
Apr 6 2011, 09:58 AM
Then a sound tactic would be to always aim to hit the ball off of any opponent's hand when in the penalty area. Not that hard given practice and an opponent(s) a few yards away, I'd imagine, especially if it follows a high ball into the box and an opposing player is on the deck, or even better trying to get up (arm rooted to the turf, easy target).

This would be very fair actually as both teams have the same disadvantage/advantage.
True, and horrible to imagine. The alternative is that referees learn to recognise deliberate handball and give the defender the justifiable benefit of the doubt.

I happened to watch Man U v United a few nights ago on DVD. Referees should be circulated footage of Maurice Malpas's save that led to Strachan's penalty. Now THAT is intentional handball.
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findus
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Jerry Kerr
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Conan the Destroyer
Apr 6 2011, 10:28 AM
findus
Apr 6 2011, 09:58 AM
Then a sound tactic would be to always aim to hit the ball off of any opponent's hand when in the penalty area. Not that hard given practice and an opponent(s) a few yards away, I'd imagine, especially if it follows a high ball into the box and an opposing player is on the deck, or even better trying to get up (arm rooted to the turf, easy target).

This would be very fair actually as both teams have the same disadvantage/advantage.
True, and horrible to imagine. The alternative is that referees learn to recognise deliberate handball and give the defender the justifiable benefit of the doubt.

I happened to watch Man U v United a few nights ago on DVD. Referees should be circulated footage of Maurice Malpas's save that led to Strachan's penalty. Now THAT is intentional handball.
The whole game, whole highlights, key highlights, or just the goals? There's just the goals on Youtube, so it misses a lot of our excellent 2nd half performance.
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The Eggman
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Tommy McLean
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Conan the Destroyer
Apr 6 2011, 09:36 AM
Given that the world at large seems incapable of establishing whether a handball is intentional (and I would venture that 90% of the time it isn't - who deliberately handles the ball in their own penalty area? You'd need to be mental) the rule should be amended to strict liability. If it hits your hand or arm it's a foul, mens rea or no.

Loads of players are sneaky bastards, making 'involuntary' movements towards the ball. Not saying it was in this case, but there are many occasions where a player's arm dooesn't need to be raised near his chest, and 'it hits' rather than his arm hitting the ball. I see it as many players making it seem like the ball hits their arm, when they actually do suspect it will hit and so claim accidental.

We don't want players just blasting it at another player's arms hoping to get a penalty for the contact, though.

It's a tough one.
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The Eggman
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Tommy McLean
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Conan the Destroyer
Apr 6 2011, 10:28 AM
Referees should be circulated footage of Maurice Malpas's save that led to Strachan's penalty. Now THAT is intentional handball.
And Luis Suarez in the World Cup (with following celebration run down the tunnel when Gyan misses) :banjmp: :haha:
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